Forum:Manta Ray?

I have no idea why, but I somehow think a colossal manta ray would make an interesting Elder Dragon boss, or something. It probably use some kind of symbiote to attack, kinda like the Yama does with those Great Thunderbugs, only this one uses some kind of Remora, or something. I don't know, really, what do you guys think? any ideas on how this would work? (note: keep in mind that this thing is supposed to be freakin' MASSIVE.)Cobalt32 21:01, March 5, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

I like the idea,I just don't know exactly how it would work.CrellinEtreyu 04:26, March 6, 2011 (UTC)

You talking a Jehn Mohren kind of fight? Sounds pretty kick-ass! SethOmega 04:42, March 6, 2011 (UTC)

@Seth: Yeah. The first stage has you following it in a dragonship on the sea, with it attacking you with jets of water (or possibly electricity), slamming the deck with one of its fins or its tail (you'll need to intercept it with the Gong or Binder), and sending its symbiotic partners (I was thinking something like some kind of remoras that live on its underside or eel-like creatures that live in its mouth) to attack you. In the second stage, the ship wrecks, and you fight it in an underwater arena-like reef, where you'll need to swim down and attack it directly or use the now-submerged, but fully functional, ballistias and Dragonator. Cobalt32 22:43, March 7, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

On second thought, I'm not sure if it should be fought from a Dragonship like Jhen Mohran in its first phase, or followed thrugh undersea caversn like Cedeus... maybe a slight combination of both?Cobalt32 15:44, March 9, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

You mean like in some sort of submarine??-CrazyOdd

@Crazy:Actually, I meant maybe either having a brief "chase" stage after the ship wrecks, or being able to swim out to the Ray during the "boat" stage, but a submarine actually sounds like a neat idea, if it could be made to fit in with MH tech. 173.22.241.179 21:31, March 11, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Man, this makes me wish they let you crawl on the monster's back to fight, like in Shadow of Colossus, but for this guy, you need to fend off the symbiotes you mentioned before taking a stab at the eye ;) Could even have breakable parts you get to carve if you act before it submerges. -Turos22

@Turos: Maybe you can do that during the boat stage, like with Jhn Mohran. Then again, mantas are usually pretty flat, so there would have to e something growing on its back you could carve, or just a soft patch of skin. Cobalt32 00:32, March 12, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

@Cobalt: Maybe some giant barnacles? xD lol -Turos22

Actually, with a bit of work, we have a really god idea here...-Crazy

@Turos: Maybe. I was actually thinking it could have a coral reef or something growing on its back. A manta ray wouldn't really have much to offer in terms of parts, except for maybe some flabby skin, so I was thinking this thing could be the underwater equivalent of Yama Tsukami and have its own, fully functional ecosystem; think as if it were a chunk of the seafloor come to life in manta ray form. It wouldn't be able to attack on its own much, maybe just be able to inflict major damage with its fins, slash from behind with its tail, or have some kind of water beam attack and/or use electricity,but it would be far too big and slow to actively fight on its own, so the creatures living in/on it (remoras on its underside, eels in its mouth, maybe crabs on its back) do most of the attacking for it. As such, it would have a variety of materials from said ecosystem, like some kind of coral and or seaweed, as well as its own flesh and parts yielded by its symbiotes. The only question remaining is what the heck is its equipment going to look like?Cobalt32 02:29, March 13, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Whatever it looks like, it will totally be epic xD Turos22 05:42, March 13, 2011 (UTC)Turos22

Okay, here's how I see it. There's a submarine going throught the ocean floor. The submarine is actually a delivery ship that brings stuff to other villages. Then, you see something moving on the sand. Then the Giant Manta thing appears. You can only attack it with underwater Ballistas and Cannons. Then the 2nd phase of fighting is like the Jhen's 1st fighting phase. It surfaces and you go to the top of the submarine. At the top, there are 2 ballistas and 2 cannons. Then there is a 3rd phase. You fight it on land. Pretty much like Jhen. It can shoot thunder beams from its 2 feeler-like organs on its head and shoot water from its mouth. KaiserLos 06:43, March 13, 2011 (UTC)

Get an aerial battle instead of an underwater one. We have Jhen/Lao/Shen in land and Ceadeus underwater. An aerial fight would be more different and interesting IMO. Ohmpahkan 09:06, March 13, 2011 (UTC)

Well, an aerial fight would be awesome, too... maybe another monster... like subspecies of the manta or something... or lets just fight Yama in that battle??-Crazy

Agreed. Yamatsukami is more suitable for aerial fights. He just needs a size rearrangement. The Manta should be underwater. Ratio of land to water is 3:1. Water battles are much more needed as there are more land ones. KaiserLos 12:17, March 13, 2011 (UTC)

Opps, forgot to write Crazy behind my last post, done now... back to the topic... i agree... but if this ever makes it into some game, make the game for PSP... :)

@Los: Nice plan, except for the last phase. This thing pretty much has to be an all-underwater fight; it can't move on, let alone get on, dry land.

@Crazy: Only if the next PSP game allows swimming like in Tri...Cobalt32 12:59, March 14, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Yah, right, forgot that P3 doesnt allow swimming :( and right again about the manta not being able to get onto land...oh, btw, can you send pms here on the wiki??...sorry for the off topic question...-crazy

@Crazy: I know there's a talk page on every user page...

Also, I think I've decided on breakable parts for this thing: the reef on its back is hard and deflects attackd, but it can be broken with a hammer to cut off the Manta's supply of crabs (they spawn from a small hole in the reef), both fins can be scarred, as well as its underside (breaking the latter reduces the number of remoras it can use), and part of its tail can be cut off and carved. Any more ideas, or is all that good?Cobalt32 01:21, March 15, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

@Cobalt32: I forgot, you can carve underwater :D But maybe if it dies, it will float to the top of the water. So there are 2 phases:


 * Underwater Battle

-Modes of attack: Ballista(underwater) Cannon (Underwater)

Manta's attacks: Thunder beams. Ramming the sub. Whipping the sub with its tail. Spawn symbiotes to attack you.

You can go underwater to fight this thing yourself.


 * Water surface Battle

-Modes of attack: Ballista, Cannon, Dragonator

Manta's attacks: Thunder beams. Water jets. Ramming the sub. Spawn Crabs to attack you.

Sincerely-KaiserLos 06:31, March 15, 2011 (UTC)

@Los: If it floats to the top, then yo have to spend some of your carve time swimming up to it instead of being right where you killed it...

I like the layout of your fight plan, but I think there should maybe be a third stage where the sub is stationary (either "sunk" or just floating), like with the second stage of the Jhen fight, and you have to swim out to it to attack it, like a Ceadeus. Or you could swim out during the first phase, but how would you leave the sub without flooding it, and how would you keep up with it while it's moving? Maybe the sub could have airlocks you have to enter to swim out, and some kind of tethers keeping you from drifting too far away from the sub...Cobalt32 15:54, March 15, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

1st thing about the updrifting... maybe like Yama, only in reverse? (Floating up instead of falling down) only a bit longer for the swimming...

And i agree, airlocks&ropes should be there... otherwise the fight would be a bit boring....Crazy

@Crazy: Yama's different; it normally floats where you can't reach it, so when it dies, it sinks, so you can. You can always reach the Manta in underwater combat, so it wouldn't necessarily need to float or sink, though it theoretically could (or maybe not; Ceadeus doesn't, and so far it's the only other underwater Elder Dragon).Cobalt32 19:54, March 15, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Well, if the sub is broken, (like the dragonship in the Jhen Battle) Then the mission would be over because the mission is to guard the sub. Even when its just "floating." It would be stupid because it is more prone to damage (well, that's what I believe) Yeah, Airlocks and ropes are a definite must. And about the carves. Maybe there should be more time. Maybe like 2minutes should be enough. But I was was thinking It will die near the sub so not much time will be consumed swimming to it. Sincerely-KaiserLos 08:38, March 16, 2011 (UTC)

yupp, you're right, los... and cobalt, doesnt yama drop down from time to time??-Crazy

@Los: If the side-by-side chase stage is the last stage of the fight, then yes, it will. If there is a third "underwater arena" stage, then it might not. Also, the Dragonship in the Jhen battle doesn't break in the second stage, it just converted into a mini-fortress. The sub, on the other hand, might just have the glass dome covering the "combat deck" (where all the ballistias and cannons are. It opens up during the surface phase) get broken, so it dives and hides on the seafloor to avoid further damage. And yes, it would definitely need more carve time, since it probably will yield a ton of carves, too.

@Crazy: Yes, but last I checked, it usually tries to stay afloat, and only touches land when stunned or dead (or body slamming).Cobalt32 16:11, March 16, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Well, actually, i havent killed Yama...i cant get past HR5 atm... :) but well i will make it latest in a month or so...

@Crazy: That's ok, I've only played Tri and only know about Yama from this wiki, anyway.Cobalt32 16:44, March 16, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Speaking of carves, I think you should be able to mine or gather from ertain spots of coral or seaweed on the Manta's back during the surface fight stage. It might not necessarily yield unique materials, but it would still give something useful...Cobalt32 23:55, March 16, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Sumthing like waterherbs or so...?? like, if you combine those with a blue mushroom, you get a deepsea potion (or sth like it) and either it allows you to stay underwater for a longer time, or it gives you a bit more HP back than the normal potion...-Crazy (P.S.: maybe someone could draw this manta)

@Crazy: You can get regular herbs from underwater plants, plus there's a plant called "airweed" that can be used to make stuff for staying underwater. This thing would probably just have a couple small gathering spots that yield that and maybe some kind of special seaweed that counts as a monster material.

Also, yes, this would be cool to draw. Hey, Purpelsgood, if you see this, do you feel like drawing this thing?Cobalt32 17:47, March 18, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

I could try the sub and if i have an idea of the manta, maybe even the weapons... if there were some

And with the seaweed as special item, that could prolly be done... and it triggered something in my head:) i have some ideas how the weapons should look like...:)

@Crazy: In terms of weapons, I think it should have at least maybe a Lance or Gunlance, a DS set, a Switch Axe, Hunting Horn, a Bow and maybe a Bowgun (or parts). I have a few more ideas for fan made weapon classes, too... Cobalt32 17:56, March 18, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

well, i have some ideas how they might look like, but not much else...

@Crazy: Me too. Those were the weapon classes I could picture having a "manta ray" motif. Cobalt32 18:11, March 18, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Yeah... im thinking about what damage and so on they should do.. of course water element... but the rest depends on: is there some upgrade, when does the manta appear in the game and so on...

@Crazy: I picture this guy being late in the game as a high-rank quest, and each weapon would probably have at least one upgrade.Cobalt32 23:55, March 18, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

I have a pretty good idea as to what it looks like...and I have it on Paper! Woot. Now its only a matter of putting thr drawing on the scanner and *Boom there it is. KaiserLos 09:38, March 19, 2011 (UTC)

So I guess its around 1000 to 1200 raw, and 400-500 waterdamage for the LS and medium blue sharpness?And Lance/ Gunlance around 400-500 with 400 or so Water... and maybe (if gunlance) shelling 3 with long or spread or so... im working on the details atm... and los, that would be great...- Crazy

@Los: Cool! Where is it?

@Crazy: uh, don't you mean GS? LS doesn't have that kind of sheer power... The Lance/GL stats sound good, though. I would picture the Lance having a Manta-shaped shield and uses the Mnta's tail tip as the lance itself, while the GL would have maybe a slightly different shaped shield, and tha gun would be made of coral. Cobalt32 17:31, March 19, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Huh, well, Akantor Katana has 1200 raw but crappy sharpness so the LS should maybe be around 900-1k while the GS has the above mentioned stats... sounds better... and the desings sound good.. and the Bowgun maybe just some crossbow with algaes (?) hanging from it...?-Crazy

@Crazy: I was thinking something closer to the Jhen Cannon, but with (of course) a manta-ish look to it, you know, like the manta's mouth and feelers for the barrel. The bow could have a seaweed drawstring, or something... Cobalt32 20:40, March 19, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

@Purpel: Awesome. Thanks in advance. Cobalt32 20:56, March 19, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

@Purpel: saw it and responded. Cobalt32 01:42, March 20, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

Well, here's the picture:



Well, Im not sure about it having real wings, shouldnt it be more like a manta ray? those dont have wings but those strange fins...-Crazy

Here's my picture, I did another one but Cobalt asked me to change it. So now it looks pretty much like a big Manta Ray with barbs. PurpleIsGood 13:21, March 20, 2011 (UTC)

Still not quite right...

Look, just start with a plain ol' real life manta ray, magnify it 5000x, make its back look like a chunk of seafloor, put some barbs on its tail (mostly near the end), add a cr*pload of remora-like fish to its underside (feel free to give these guys teeth), and that should be about it.

If you feel like it, you could maybe design the sub you fight it in, too. The only major detail we've settled on is that it needs a glass-domed "battle deck" on the top where the ballistias and cannons are. The glass should probably have a reinforced metal frame for stability that allows it to open sideways when the sub surfaces. The rest is up to you, it just needs to look MH tech. Sub should be big, and the ray should be bigger still. Cobalt32 13:55, March 20, 2011 (UTC)Cobalt32

and it should be woodenor something like that, cant imagine the game with some modern submarine...-Crazy